Intro/Outro: 00:00

Welcome to Flowstars, candid conversations between doctor Peter O'Toole and the big hitters of flow cytometry, brought to you by Beckman Coulter at Bite Size Bio.

Peter O'Toole: 00:11

In this special episode of Flowstars recorded live in Edinburgh, cyto 2024 with special guests. We discuss some of the leading topics in flow cytometry including what changes cytometrists would like to see.

André Görgens: 00:24

Maybe making it more widespreadly widespread available to everybody, especially positive instruments are really tough to get hands on for people, especially in northwestern countries.

Peter O'Toole: 00:38

The importance of encouraging young researchers to consider place cytometry as a research tool.

Vera Tang: 00:44

Adopting new technology, inviting getting the scientists in the in the university to utilize something new. If you tell them, you know, hey, we can detect EVs, we can detect viruses, A lot of them are very reticent about it, and they like the technologies that they're familiar with.

Peter O'Toole: 01:03

And we reflect on the capabilities of the current cytometers.

Claudia Maria Radu: 01:07

But remember, they're important to have the possibility to sorting this. Now we can do it. How are you doing it? With the sight of Flexa Septi.

Peter O'Toole: 01:18

All in this episode of Flow Stars.

Mario Cox: 01:25

Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. Hello, and a very warm welcome to our evening event. Okay. Hello. Good evening, ladies and gentlemen.

Mario Cox: 01:40

It's a great pleasure for me to welcome you to our live episode of Flowstars here from CYTO 2024. My name is Mario Cox. I'm leading the global marketing and medical scientific affairs teams of Beckman Coulter, and we're very happy and very fortunate to have you all here with us tonight. My job is a very easy 1. So, my role is, to the is to introduce our host for tonight.

Mario Cox: 02:07

And in case if you are aware of what Flowstar is, you know him already. If you don't know what Flowstar is, it's a very simple explanation. It's a podcast that we have started 2, 3 years ago, Peckhamakota Life Sciences, together with BYITESAS Bio. And Flowstars is about interviewing these stars in flow cytometry. And this is what Peter O'Toole is doing.

Mario Cox: 02:32

So if you go to the YouTube channel, you can learn a lot about what happened in flow cytometry, big milestones. You're going to see and meet the movers and shakers in flow cytometry in our industry. And you get good insights into where this technology, the applications are going in the future. For me, now my role, as I said, is to get us started. So, therefore, it's my great pleasure to introduce to introduce Peter O'Toole.

Mario Cox: 03:01

Peter is the head of the technology facility at the University of York. He's head of the, department of imaging and cytometry. And as you know, 123, 1 more, he's also the president of the Royal Microscopy Society. So please join me and welcome Peter Orteur to the stage. Thank you.

Peter O'Toole: 03:35

Wow. You're all in the dark as far as I'm concerned. Well, you are about what we're gonna talk about. Okay. Evening, everybody.

Peter O'Toole: 03:43

Yeah. Thank you. Okay. So it is a live podcast. We will be recording it in front of a live audience, so be careful of sound, please, just for our guests themselves.

Peter O'Toole: 03:53

Okay? They like to be heard, not as much as I like to be heard. Okay. So the dress the easiest thing actually, I've got an easy job because lots of you have actually posted questions for our guests this evening. So thank you, Beckman Coulter, for allowing us to do this, and thanks for everyone who's actually sent in their questions.

Peter O'Toole: 04:11

If you're happy to actually put your hand up when I talk about your question, please do. I bet no 1 does. Okay. So our first guest for this evening is Claudio Radu from Italy. We have Beaver Tongue from Canada.

Peter O'Toole: 04:40

And Andre Gorgens from Sweden. See, III did get all your questions. So I thought, actually, the first bit of the evening is they all have something in common, is that none of them think that size matters. So we're like, I think there's a commonality that, you know, it's bigger than to everything, and they're all into the small and beautiful things, the small particles. So there is actually a common theme about this, and I thought we'd start on that especially because of the nano system that's been coming out.

Peter O'Toole: 05:21

So, actually, I'm going to ask first. Who has a CytoFlex? Claudia?

Claudia Maria Radu: 05:27

Yes. Absolutely. Not only 1.

Peter O'Toole: 05:30

Not only 1? How many?

Claudia Maria Radu: 05:32

I have a Cytoflex and Cytoflex SFP, the sorting.

Peter O'Toole: 05:36

Oh, you have a sorting 1? Yeah. Vera?

Vera Tang: 05:40

I have 1.

Peter O'Toole: 05:41

You have 1?

Vera Tang: 05:42

I have 1. Only 1? Siblex S.

Peter O'Toole: 05:45

Okay. So the small 1. That's okay. It is a

Vera Tang: 05:48

small 1. It's dedicated for the small stuff.

Peter O'Toole: 05:50

An ombre.

André Görgens: 05:53

I don't have 10I have 1 in the core facility nearby though that I can use whenever I want, and I've used 1 in the lab I've been before, but not in our own lab currently.

Peter O'Toole: 06:03

You don't have? Sorry. Contee, you have someone to sell to. Okay. So that's 1 of the first audience questions that came in was what made you select flow cytometry as a technology that you want to stay hours working with?

Peter O'Toole: 06:19

Who answered who asked that question? No one's brave enough to say yes to it. But someone asked the same question in a different way, which is what made you choose a career in flow cytometry or did you choose it? So I'm gonna start with Vira on this 1.

Vera Tang: 06:36

Did I choose it? So I have a PhD. I'm an immunologist by training. I I did a lot of viral immunity, always been interested in viruses, so I've done a lot of flow. Did I really want a career as a core facility manager?

Vera Tang: 06:51

That was not planned. But after post doc, the core facility director at the time said, do you want a job? And I said, yes. I want to be employed. And 12 years later, here we are.

Peter O'Toole: 07:09

And Andre?

André Görgens: 07:10

I, didn't really choose it, but I did my PhD in hematotic stem cell biology. So then, yeah, consequently, you have to use flow cytometers, and that's where I learned and get both in contact with flow cytometers. So, obviously, I began to love them, love to set essays, up and, use them on a daily basis. So that's how it started.

Peter O'Toole: 07:35

So you started in your immunology and then differentiated into flow cytometry. I guess that's appropriate. Claudia?

Claudia Maria Radu: 07:41

I think so that, cytometry choose me. Yeah. Because, at the university, say you have to work with extracellular vesicles. Oh, no. With the breeze?

Claudia Maria Radu: 07:53

I need something to see them. And I start with cytometry. And excuse me. Because cytometry from Beckman is the only 1 that work really with the with the breeze at the the first.

Peter O'Toole: 08:07

She's not being paid to say that. That's a good point. Okay. So, actually, there's a really interesting question that came in. So what hurdles have you faced in your career, and what actions have you actually taken to ensure that they they they don't happen again?

Peter O'Toole: 08:26

So what hurdles have you faced in your career? It's it's it's it's the person you asked that question in here. I knew this would happen. No one's going to admit to anything. We have to be moosy on anonymity not oh, the words that means you we don't know who you are.

Claudia Maria Radu: 08:41

Claudia? I think so that 1 of the big problem for all the researchers is to find funds money to buy the

André Görgens: 08:51

instruments. Yeah.

Claudia Maria Radu: 08:52

This is the problem of all our career. You have to work with instruments. Big big instruments with little money or important instruments. But, I convinced my institution to buy for me.

Peter O'Toole: 09:09

But wouldn't it be easier if they sold it as cheaper?

Vera Tang: 09:13

No. I need service.

Claudia Maria Radu: 09:17

I need service.

Peter O'Toole: 09:19

And and actually so actually, Viva will say go on. What did you say, Viva?

Vera Tang: 09:23

I said the service.

Peter O'Toole: 09:25

Yeah. The cost of the service. Yeah. Yeah. That that that is a is a core facility.

Peter O'Toole: 09:31

That's 1 of the biggest challenges. Is it?

Vera Tang: 09:33

Actually, for us in Canada, it's not as hard to get funding to buy equipment, but it is challenging to keep supporting the equipment and getting adequate support for our equipment, well trained engineers.

Peter O'Toole: 09:49

So what would you say your biggest hurdle is, though?

Vera Tang: 09:52

Adopting new technology, inviting getting the scientists in the in the university to utilize something new. If you tell them, you know, hey. We can detect EVs. We can detect viruses. A lot of them are very reticent about it, and they like the technologies that they're familiar with.

Peter O'Toole: 10:12

Okay. And Andre?

André Görgens: 10:14

There's definitely been a lot, but, I mean, 1 that comes to mind is, moving from my PhD lab in Germany to the lab in Sweden I went to to understand if it's more because it's like a a known lab for EV Engineering already at that time, which was, like, 7, 8 years ago already. And, 1 challenge was definitely to convince them to use flow cytometry for EVs because at that time, it wasn't, like, a no brainer, and it wasn't used a lot and not in a good way necessarily. So convincing them to buy a flow cytometer for me to do my research was, some quite simple.

Peter O'Toole: 10:51

Okay. So now I said at the start that size doesn't matter, and yet here we all are talking about size. You've all gone down a

André Görgens: 10:57

small path in your route.

Peter O'Toole: 11:01

Are you satisfied with where we are with regards to analysis of viable particles, EVs, small particles?

Vera Tang: 11:08

No. We gotta keep pushing.

Peter O'Toole: 11:09

Gotta keep pushing?

Vera Tang: 11:10

Gotta keep pushing.

Peter O'Toole: 11:12

Okay. Andre?

Claudia Maria Radu: 11:12

I mean

André Görgens: 11:13

Alright. Fully agree, but, I mean, it's an exciting time. We have have made quite some progress. But I fully agree we have to keep pushing.

Vera Tang: 11:20

And I think when it comes to viruses, there are all a lot of sort of relevant viruses that are much smaller. A lot of people are into CAR T cells now. AAVs are being used everywhere, and they are 26 nanometers. So if you wanna phenotype those, you gotta get down.

Peter O'Toole: 11:42

It's actually I'm I'm going to widen the question. Why is plasitometry I I it can't do 26 nanometers. So why is flow cytometry so good for small particle analysis?

Claudia Maria Radu: 11:55

I think so that, you have, you need a basic cytometer that go with low ranges of bees because you know the problem of the all cytometers is to detect under, 2, 200 nanometers. And, then we remember that the technology did not stop. And we need every time new technology, new instruments go every time lower in the range of, for a beast, from virus for everything.

Peter O'Toole: 12:30

Okay. Andre?

André Görgens: 12:34

I mean, it's it's a very good fit. Of course, there are other complementary methods, but it's just a good fit because it's quantitative, and it can be made very specific. So we can run and it can be made well at the high throughput at the current stage. Of course, there is room for improvement. But that means that you can run a lot of samples while being sure that what you measure is specifically EVs or other small particles, and it can be very accurate and quantitative.

André Görgens: 13:00

So that's a huge advantage.

Vera Tang: 13:02

Serial particle analysis sensitivity, fast, cheap Yep. Once you bought the instrument, and if you think about it, like, the sensitivity that you get, the ability to assess that heterogeneity in a sample, they're really I mean, how many other options are there?

Peter O'Toole: 13:22

No one's mentioned color. Sorry? No one's mentioned color. There's lots of partners and allies out there, but the colors, aren't they important?

Vera Tang: 13:32

Yes. But you're how many how many parameters are you gonna do on an EV? Yeah. That's the

Claudia Maria Radu: 13:37

Oh, yes. Yeah.

Vera Tang: 13:39

Yep. That's More than 1.

Claudia Maria Radu: 13:43

That's the big small. You don't, need to use 3, 4 colors.

Vera Tang: 13:49

But, I mean, multi parameter, I mean, with that, that is part of the single particle assessing heterogeneity aspects, I guess.

Claudia Maria Radu: 13:57

But remember, they're important to have the possibility to sorting this. Now we

Peter O'Toole: 14:02

can do it. How are you doing it?

Claudia Maria Radu: 14:05

With CytoFlex SRT. CytoFlex SRT. And you can go to understand what's inside. What is the cargo of these AVs, flexible solar vesicles, within, next generation sequencing with, analysis, the proteins, lipidomics, proteomics.

Peter O'Toole: 14:29

And what what size are you getting down to on an SRT there?

Claudia Maria Radu: 14:33

Now 70 70 nanometers. It's okay. Important it to clear.

Peter O'Toole: 14:39

Yeah. I I was at a a workshop earlier today talking about, Isaac and maybe setting up mentorship programs. You know what? I I think we need well, I I need mentoring because I think there's a lot of skills to get to that level, especially on SRT. I think that's a really good point, I think, for for Isaac to think about is getting these specialist areas as well.

Peter O'Toole: 15:01

And maybe it's a a Karen somewhere, I think, you know, went on and you where was it you went and did your shadowing with Andres? Okay. So, again, so so we sent off because the skill sets for small particle there's a lot of the sample prep side. It's not just the analysis, is it?

André Görgens: 15:23

Definitely. Yeah. I mean, most of the time, I think, is at least an hour left spent on planning the experiment, really knowing what the material is, and preparing the sample before you actually run the experiment. And, I mean, if you run it for a new question experiment the first time, you have to validate, like, answer questions how you run your sample and how you use your different probes. So there's a lot of homework to do before you can start.

André Görgens: 15:48

Once everything is set up, you can run pretty much a lot of samples very fast. But the start for any new setup is a bit more laborious. Yeah.

Peter O'Toole: 15:59

I I remember when Coulter bought out the Nanaflex, and I'd just seen the Lego Cytoplex. And I genuinely thought that was a no no no. Obviously, I didn't genuinely think that was a it doesn't matter. It's a

Vera Tang: 16:15

Pocket cytometer?

Peter O'Toole: 16:16

Yeah. Pocket cytometer. So the next question, someone says, do you do you name your cytometers? I'm gonna start closest to me because I think the answer is yes here.

Claudia Maria Radu: 16:28

Yeah. Have a name. The CytoFlex Sorting, it's the names is, Ciccobello.

Claudia Maria Radu: 16:36

Which name?

Claudia Maria Radu: 16:37

Ciccobello is dolls from, children and, is a male. It's very nice dolls, small dolls, and I say that it's my ticselbello.

Peter O'Toole: 16:50

So you think it's your child? Yeah. Okay. Vira?

Vera Tang: 16:56

I didn't name my Cetaphlex. I did name my Astrios at 1 point.

Peter O'Toole: 17:03

Can you repeat its name?

Vera Tang: 17:05

I named her Sybil.

Peter O'Toole: 17:06

Sorry?

Vera Tang: 17:07

I named her Sybil, the woman with the split personality and the 7 different personalities. You don't want bad civil.

André Görgens: 17:21

I didn't name any of them. Very romantic.

Peter O'Toole: 17:27

I'm I'm never sure why they called it a MOFLOW because it's 1 letter short of a no flow. III really I can't I love my legacy no flow that I used to have. I love my Astros as well. I just quickly say that. Then, do you know what?

Peter O'Toole: 17:44

This isn't a question. So I don't know who I used to worry about causing DNA damage in my cells by exposing them to UV light source. Now I worry about cooking them with my infrared light source, with the 8 to 8 nanometer lasers. I think I don't think you'll find it's not really a big little microwave. It's not gonna cook your sample to 8 nanometers.

Peter O'Toole: 18:05

So what is your favorite tool or instrument in your lab? I'm gonna start with Viva this time.

Vera Tang: 18:12

I have all flow cytometers in my lab.

Peter O'Toole: 18:16

So which is your favorite?

Vera Tang: 18:18

Well, I can't say that.

Peter O'Toole: 18:19

Oh, you can.

Vera Tang: 18:19

It's like picking a favorite child.

Peter O'Toole: 18:22

Oh, you can then.

Vera Tang: 18:25

Whichever 1 gives me the least problems at a time. I have to say my Cytoplix and I, we've reached. We we had some troublesome times. We had some, you know, challenging parts of our relationship, and now we're finally at, you know, equilibrium.

Peter O'Toole: 18:43

It's got over the teenager.

Vera Tang: 18:45

We right. We figured out each other.

Peter O'Toole: 18:46

I I knew I now know

Vera Tang: 18:48

what it's complaining about, and I address the issue before it starts.

Peter O'Toole: 18:54

Andre, baby. 2 instruments.

André Görgens: 18:56

I I really also can't make, definitive choice. I mean, depending on the purpose, they are all great to some extent. What I definitely spent the most time with is, on this image stream stream and later on the search stream just because I used them for EV analysis early on and spent hours and hours sitting. And And

Peter O'Toole: 19:16

you've got a nice YouTube on that, haven't you? So you've got a nice new YouTube lecture.

André Görgens: 19:21

I yeah. I think there's something on YouTube about yeah.

Peter O'Toole: 19:24

See, I've done my research.

André Görgens: 19:25

Yeah. Nice.

Peter O'Toole: 19:25

Yeah. It's not bad.

André Görgens: 19:27

Just watch the holidays.

Claudia Maria Radu: 19:28

I can't, do differences between my babies. Sorry. It's 2. And now I wait for the small 1, the side of Lex Nano. I can view differences.

Peter O'Toole: 19:43

Okay. So some quick fire stations for you. Coffee or tea? Coffee. Coffee?

Peter O'Toole: 19:49

Tea. Tea? Coffee. Coffee. Sorry.

Peter O'Toole: 19:54

Beer or wine? Beer.

Vera Tang: 19:56

Neither.

Peter O'Toole: 19:57

Neither.

Claudia Maria Radu: 19:58

Neither. Neither.

Peter O'Toole: 20:01

Scotch. Which was my next question?

Claudia Maria Radu: 20:11

Chocolate or cheese? Chocolate. Chocolate. Chocolate. Chocolate.

Claudia Maria Radu: 20:14

What would you say?

Peter O'Toole: 20:15

Chocolate or cheese? Oh. 0. Yeah.

Vera Tang: 20:17

Chocolate. That's chocolate. Chocolate versus cheese. Chocolate. Oh, is it chips?

André Görgens: 20:22

Oh, great. I guess cheese. Yeah.

Peter O'Toole: 20:24

Cheese. Cheese. Okay. Chocolate or chips? Just for you.

Peter O'Toole: 20:28

Chips. French fries or chunky chips?

Vera Tang: 20:31

No. No. Canadian. Flat. Crispy.

Vera Tang: 20:34

Crispy. Crispy. Crispy. Crisps.

Peter O'Toole: 20:36

Oh, you need to come on. You're you're in the UK now. Okay. Yeah. What's your favorite color?

André Görgens: 20:45

Blue. Blue? Blue. Yeah.

Vera Tang: 20:48

Black.

Peter O'Toole: 20:48

Black. Is that a color?

Vera Tang: 20:54

Absence of color. Pink.

Peter O'Toole: 20:58

Sorry? Pink. Pink. Floor sink. Oh.

Peter O'Toole: 21:04

See, you call yourself cytometrist, and you can't even think of choosing a color itself. If you could change 1 thing, replace an atomically, what would you change? I'll start with Andre.

André Görgens: 21:22

That's a tough 1. Yeah. Maybe making it more widespreadly widespread available to everybody, especially postpaid instruments are really tough to get hands on for people, especially in northwestern countries.

Peter O'Toole: 21:40

Okay. So low, middle income countries

André Görgens: 21:42

Yeah.

Peter O'Toole: 21:43

Side of things. Okay.

André Görgens: 21:44

That could be changed. Would be great.

Peter O'Toole: 21:45

So, again, I'll give a plug for Isaac and the the working group that's tasked to do in that as well.

Vera Tang: 21:50

Less mysterious, less of a black box. So people

Peter O'Toole: 21:54

I thought you liked black.

Vera Tang: 21:57

You caught. No. For just for more people to understand that what they're seeing is actual physical phenomena, and it's not magic. And, you know, just don't blame the instrument all the time when something goes wrong.

Peter O'Toole: 22:10

Oh, I never blame the instruments.

Vera Tang: 22:12

You never do.

Peter O'Toole: 22:13

No. I never. I blame Gavin. I had a sympathy vote for Kevin over there. I didn't mean that Kevin.

Peter O'Toole: 22:23

I meant my other Kevin. Sorry, Karen, if you're watching. I'm joking. I meant that Karen. It doesn't matter.

Peter O'Toole: 22:31

It was Graham's fault. Claudia?

Claudia Maria Radu: 22:35

Not change anything, but, only to say to go down with the money, to buy all other people and the possibility to buy Sitemflex.

Peter O'Toole: 22:45

Back on the the side of the the cost and the value of that. So actually, we've only got about 7, 8 minutes left. I'd like to introduce, Matthew Goff from Bettman Coulter. Where's Matthew? So Matthew's here to do a little teaser in a minute, but not yet before we launch that because, Matthew's also going to be, assaulted with questions.

Peter O'Toole: 23:15

So, who hosts the best site of party?

Matthew G: 23:19

Oh, in all in all of history? I I'm sorry to my current employer. Pre BD Flow, Joe. They had the best parties. They did.

Peter O'Toole: 23:32

That's fine.

Mario Cox: 23:34

Oh, go on. They were here. Everybody knows. They were here. Okay.

Mario Cox: 23:38

Alright.

Peter O'Toole: 23:39

Okay. Viva, best I best I to party. Tonight. Oh, okay. Tonight.

Peter O'Toole: 23:49

Yeah. Right. Oh, great.

André Görgens: 23:51

Obviously, Beckman Coulter. Yeah.

Matthew G: 24:02

Come on. I'm gonna hear about it later.

Peter O'Toole: 24:08

When you retire, will you ever look at another cytometer? And I'm gonna start actually at that end and come back. Okay. Will you would you have a look at another cytometer?

André Görgens: 24:17

I'm pretty sure. Yeah. I mean, I don't see any reason to never look back or something. I mean, it's something I like.

Peter O'Toole: 24:23

Yeah.

André Görgens: 24:24

I would have like to have 1.

Peter O'Toole: 24:26

Okay.

André Görgens: 24:26

Hello?

Peter O'Toole: 24:27

Tim?

Vera Tang: 24:28

Sure. Why not? What's the price? For the right price?

Peter O'Toole: 24:34

Nadia.

Claudia Maria Radu: 24:35

Yes. But, I prefer CytoFlex, and I'm very I'm very jealous for my cytometer.

Peter O'Toole: 24:42

So you're gonna retire with your CytoFlex? Yeah. So that comes to another thing with the longevity of the instruments and making sure they last a long time because you're not that's a long way away yet.

Matthew G: 24:54

My my retirement plans involve a a van and wineries and a cytometer, so I'm gonna keep it going. I'm gonna

André Görgens: 25:01

go go do go do

Matthew G: 25:02

the contract work and keep my hands busy.

Peter O'Toole: 25:04

So a question from last year, who's hosted the best site home meeting as a whole? I'm gonna start with Veera.

Vera Tang: 25:14

Vancouver, Canadian.

Peter O'Toole: 25:16

Vancouver? I thought 1 trip notice, but I won't get oh. Claudia?

Claudia Maria Radu: 25:24

We don't do till now. Maybe Italy in the next, future. Alright. What's the best,

André Görgens: 25:32

So the question was

Peter O'Toole: 25:33

what Best site check.

André Görgens: 25:35

So III liked all of the site meetings, but, I mean, the the first 1, I think, was in for me in Boston 2017 or something. Boston? And I I remember that being a really great meeting and a great experience to, like, see a new world of of people being into the same thing.

Vera Tang: 25:52

Was really good

Peter O'Toole: 25:53

to see. I'm so glad.

Vera Tang: 25:54

Yeah. That's

Peter O'Toole: 25:54

good. Matthew?

Matthew G: 25:56

I I I'm gonna defer to the crowd. I would be split pretty hard between Vancouver and Boston. They're both pretty excellent meetings.

Peter O'Toole: 26:03

So organizing of Edinburgh. Jury's still I need the jury's still out.

Matthew G: 26:09

We're not coming. We're only day 1.

Peter O'Toole: 26:10

Come on. Stay with me.

Claudia Maria Radu: 26:13

We have to see the future. Italy.

Peter O'Toole: 26:16

Okay.

Vera Tang: 26:16

There you go.

Peter O'Toole: 26:17

So I I have to like so this is like a it's a bit like a chat show host where someone comes on near the end because they're promoting their book. Okay? So Matthew's up here to actually, give us a little teaser. And, actually, if we could just, run the video, we can, just show the teaser for Matt. So, Matthew, tell us about your book.

Peter O'Toole: 27:10

Yeah.

Matthew G: 27:15

We've always been proud of what the Cytaflex has been able to do, and it's not been lost on us that our customers wanted to move forward and wanted to move into a spectral space. And, the question for the longest time has been how do you get there? You know, how do you how do you approach it from a a novel angle, you know, AAA novel, you know, offering that is, attractive to the researchers and is, you know, fundamentally different than what they have access to right now. And so after, some time, we we found something that we think carries, a really strong message around sustainability, growth, the concept of of Cytoplex in and of itself. Right?

Matthew G: 27:55

The ability to evolve, with your system and to have your system evolve with your needs. And so, we're excited to show, this poster of our prototype system. As you can see, we have the top half of it here. This is up and our our wonderful, Kelly Andrews, 1 of our senior staff development scientists is here supporting that and is happy to answer your questions on the data that we acquired. And if you wanna know how we acquired it and kinda what we're working on behind the scenes, we invite you to our innovation suite.

Matthew G: 28:28

We'd love to host you and, talk to you and get your feedback and entertain some questions. And for those of you, if, the timing doesn't work out and you still wanna have that conversation, you

Peter O'Toole: 28:41

know what's amazed me is is we see the poster down here as well as up on the wall, and all 3 guests were hooked on that poster looking at it, trying to work it out.

Matthew G: 28:53

This is a our this is a poster of 40 our 40 pillar OMIV 69 panel,

Peter O'Toole: 28:59

run on

Matthew G: 29:00

our our 88, detector, prototype system. 88. 88. Yep. 88.

Matthew G: 29:07

88 detectors. Yep. Paired to our, Cytaflex LX.

Peter O'Toole: 29:11

So if I'm brutal I did start coming up a hard time. Yeah. Yeah. Sorry. Everyone's doing specs for

Matthew G: 29:19

That's true.

Peter O'Toole: 29:20

So what's different?

Matthew G: 29:22

Yeah. I think the approach is I think the approach is different. I think going at this from, the direction of, you know, I I'll brag a little bit. We're very proud of this. The middle of last year, we celebrated the 10000th sale of a CytoFlex or of a Flex instrument.

Matthew G: 29:38

Right? And that's across an incredible portfolio, including the CytoFlex SLX, DXFlex, and SRT. And now with the Nano coming into Vogue in the last month, we saw an opportunity to enhance, enhance the analytical power that our customers have access to right now, and a chance to offer an incredible value proposition to customers that want to start in a particular place and grow into another, or customers that are looking for, you know, full scale additional capabilities that aren't available in the market right now.

Peter O'Toole: 30:13

That sounds cool, but you've got the post.

Claudia Maria Radu: 30:16

But how

Peter O'Toole: 30:17

III I'm intrigued because it has taken a time.

Matthew G: 30:21

It has taken a few steps. So

Peter O'Toole: 30:23

what was so hard about getting it there?

Matthew G: 30:26

I don't think that it was technically hard. I think what was hard was presenting something that was actually novel. Right? In an approach, I think, it's it's not hard to put more lasers or more detectors on an instrument. I don't I don't think that that's an insurmountable task at all.

Matthew G: 30:40

I think that building and sustaining a software system and coming up with a way to solve problems that exist. Right? Coming up with a a new algorithm strategy, coming up with an approach, to make something, you know, financially and technically accessible. Right? That's what we're really focused on.

Matthew G: 30:57

I I don't I don't think that it's it's entirely difficult to just, you know, build in your box. I think what's difficult is to look at other challenges that exist in flow cytometry. You know, namely the questions that we see from the community, questions about sustainability, questions about accessibility.

Peter O'Toole: 31:13

K. So I think there's a poster to go and see about this. Do anything else you wanna add to this?

Matthew G: 31:19

No. We're we're really excited about this, and we're really excited to to show you what we've done to to pair with, those of you that that wanna pair with us and to see what we can do in the future. It's got incredible potential, and we can't wait to see what it can do in your hands.

Peter O'Toole: 31:33

K. Interesting?

André Görgens: 31:36

Yes. Definitely interesting. But it has an auto center, though.

Peter O'Toole: 31:40

Will it

André Görgens: 31:41

have an auto center?

Matthew G: 31:42

Well, it's yeah. It it does. You know, it's a it's an extension of our LX and our s platform, so it does have an auto sampler That's great. Already ready to go.

André Görgens: 31:51

Just hoping you

Peter O'Toole: 31:52

had to be Yeah. No.

Matthew G: 31:52

We haven't talked. Be right.

Vera Tang: 31:55

So you're saying my existing LX or s can be upgraded?

Matthew G: 32:01

I'm saying that your existing s or LX can be upgraded. And, don't don't think of this as a classic, like, tear the guts out, change it upgrade. This is an additional capability.

André Görgens: 32:11

Cool. So

Claudia Maria Radu: 32:13

Very interesting. Just I have to found other money to buy

Peter O'Toole: 32:18

it. Okay. It was tiny. How much is it gonna cost? I was waiting for you to ask that question.

Peter O'Toole: 32:23

And then it says way too expensive. It needs to be lower. Think about that and the service needs. What about service contract price?

Matthew G: 32:29

Well, we're still in the midst of figuring out all the numbers on the back end, but, we expect to be able to, put it well within customer expectations. You know, we do we are reaching out to customers and getting an idea of what is the right price, what is the right price. I

Peter O'Toole: 32:42

so you go okay. So so what's the right price in the service contract? I'm gonna go with the beaver issue. You're pressing on service. What would be the right price for service contract?

Vera Tang: 32:50

Well, I think right now industry standards is 10% of purchase price. Nice.

Peter O'Toole: 32:55

Not in the UK. What is my you don't see my I I was on the yeah. You should never be 10% to a postage price because it's ridiculous. And actually, in the UK, for the microscopy world, it's about 3 a half percent. It depends what's on it.

Peter O'Toole: 33:11

And actually, I think the UK is pretty I I think Coulter applaud. Actually, at this point, service contracts in the UK aren't outrageous.

Vera Tang: 33:19

Why is that?

Peter O'Toole: 33:20

Maybe we negotiate. Maybe they sell it to us for a lot more. Maybe we're overpaying for the product to start with. I don't know.

Matthew G: 33:31

I am, this is this is where I get to pull the object for it. I'm a I'm a I'm a box and product guy, you know, service is a service has its own product, and it has its own life cycle and its own, you know, conversations with customers. So that's something that

Peter O'Toole: 33:45

we can

Vera Tang: 33:46

There's not been enough scotch for this

Peter O'Toole: 33:50

And that's a beautiful taste. So actually so now we do have whiskey tasting at the back end of so as you go out in the back corner, we then so go chase some whiskey, and we then have a ceilidh running in here for your it's a bit like flow cytometry dynamics. Okay? If it's a lot of turbulence, it goes back to the lungs. They won't synchronize.

Peter O'Toole: 34:11

It's fast enough.

André Görgens: 34:12

That's right.

Peter O'Toole: 34:13

So I think if you could all join me, please, to thank our guests this evening. And finally, a big thank you to Bettman Coulter for the entertainment and the hosting and, their hospitality this evening. So Bettman Coulter, thank you. Enjoy your evening.